Ati släpper Stream Computing

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Melding Plague

Ati släpper Stream Computing

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Observera att samma trivselregler gäller i kommentarstrådarna som i övriga forumet och att brott mot dessa kan leda till avstängning. Kontakta redaktionen om du vill uppmärksamma fel i artikeln eller framföra andra synpunkter.

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Medlem

Riktigt trevligt, hoppas vi får se ATi fysik inom en snar framtid. Hoppas också att den presterar bättre än Aegias lösning.

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Riktigt häftigt.

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"The flames of freedom. How lovely. How just. Ahh, my precious anarchy.."

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Medlem

Cooolt helt klart.. Sedan är bara frågan om det kommer slå.

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Medlem

vadå är det nå speciellt kort man behöver? trodde de bara hade fixat så man kunde beräkna saker med GPU'n när den inte redan används för fullt? aja, jag är lite vilsen..

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Ursprungligen inskrivet av katanaa
vadå är det nå speciellt kort man behöver? trodde de bara hade fixat så man kunde beräkna saker med GPU'n när den inte redan används för fullt? aja, jag är lite vilsen..

Av vad jag har läst så har jag förståt att man kan inte köra beräkningar/fysik på X1900-serien kort utan man måste köpa ett specielt gkort, som på bilden.

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"The flames of freedom. How lovely. How just. Ahh, my precious anarchy.."

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Medlem

Jaha, då var det officiellt så jag antar att jag får snacka om det.. FireSTREAM 2U korten har funnits sedan i somras och har kunnat beställas av (oss) betatestare av ATIs GPGPU api. Kortet är bästa möjliga för att utföra beräkningar byggt på existerande komponenter. Det har alltså inga specialfunktioner som inte finns på andra grafikkort.

Gällande vad som går att utföra på grafikkorten så går det alltså inte använda grafikkort för att accelerera vad som helst, utan endast ganska speciella problem. Problemet måste gå att formulera på så sätt att varje beräkning är oberoende av andra beräkningar. Då kan man utföra beräkningen m.h.a. pixelshaders där varje pixel/texel får representera en datapunkt man räknar på. Datan lagras som en textur, beräkningarna som en pixel shader och själva lösningen av problemet får man genom att "rita" en rektangel och läsa tillbaka datan. M.a.o. så kan rätt typ av problem lösas extremt snabbt, medan de flesta uppgifter inte går att utföra alls på GPU..

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Medlem

Jag vill inte hjälpa USA att hitta mer terrorister, men att forska lite skulle jag nog kunna tänka mig med mitt kort.

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Mycket Bly I Terrängen...

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Discokungen
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Ursprungligen inskrivet av MagWe
Jaha, då var det officiellt så jag antar att jag får snacka om det.. FireSTREAM 2U korten har funnits sedan i somras och har kunnat beställas av (oss) betatestare av ATIs GPGPU api. Kortet är bästa möjliga för att utföra beräkningar byggt på existerande komponenter. Det har alltså inga specialfunktioner som inte finns på andra grafikkort.

Gällande vad som går att utföra på grafikkorten så går det alltså inte använda grafikkort för att accelerera vad som helst, utan endast ganska speciella problem. Problemet måste gå att formulera på så sätt att varje beräkning är oberoende av andra beräkningar. Då kan man utföra beräkningen m.h.a. pixelshaders där varje pixel/texel får representera en datapunkt man räknar på. Datan lagras som en textur, beräkningarna som en pixel shader och själva lösningen av problemet får man genom att "rita" en rektangel och läsa tillbaka datan. M.a.o. så kan rätt typ av problem lösas extremt snabbt, medan de flesta uppgifter inte går att utföra alls på GPU..

Vilket i praktiken innebär att detta grafikkortet klarar av att behandla enormt många trådar men blir ineffektiv vid få trådar jämfört med en CPU?

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Medlem
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Ursprungligen inskrivet av Flamso
Vilket i praktiken innebär att detta grafikkortet klarar av att behandla enormt många trådar men blir ineffektiv vid få trådar jämfört med en CPU?

likheterna med trådar i en CPU är ganska många, men det är inte exakt samma sak. På GPUn (FireSTREAM eller vilket annat modernt grafikkort som helst) så måste varje tråd utföra exakt samma sak. Det är bara datan man räknar på som skiljer trådarna åt, programmkoden som gör beräkningen (=shadern) är samma för alla trådar. Dessutom är GPUn lite begränsad i hur avancerade dessa program får vara. (t.ex. hur långa dom kan vara och hur man använder if-satser osv..). Dessutom kan man inte skriva data med "random access" (däremot kan man läsa med random access..)

ett enkelt exempel:

(1): a[i] = b[ c[i] ]
(2): a[ c[i] ] = b[i]

där i=[0..6], b= {a,b,c,d,e,f,g} och c = {6,5,4,3,2,1,0} ger båda resultatet resultatet a = { g,f,e,d,c,b,a } om det kompileras med en for-loop på CPUn. Endast alternativ (1) går att implementera på GPU. I den första fallet läses datan i omvänd ordning och skrivs i rätt ordning. I det andra fallet läses datan i rätt ordning och skrives i omvänd ordning. På CPU skrivs ett element åt gången, på GPU skrivs alla elementen samtidigt.

Så för att sammanfatta så har du rätt på det stora hela, men man får komma ihåg att varje "tråd" är betydligt mer begränsad än en CPU-tråd.

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Det ska väl gå lika bra att räkna på ett FireSTREAM-kort som på ett vanligt kort alltså? Bara det att man kan ha ganska många FireSTREAM-kort i en dator?

Det som Stanford jobbar på är förövrigt Folding@home, vilket ni tidigare rapporterat. Se här: http://folding.stanford.edu/FAQ-ATI.html. Tydligen ska de släppa den klienten idag: http://folding.stanford.edu/news.html

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"För hemlandssäkerhet kan Stream Computing analysera foto och video från exempelvis flygplatser."
Mhm, låt användarna skapa sin egen BB.

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Sanningen måste döljas!

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Medlem

Hemlandssäkerhet?!

Snälla jag blir deprimerad av denna anglifiering

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Hedersmedlem

Beta GPU-klienten är släppt nu. Info @ http://folding.stanford.edu/FAQ-ATI.html
Tanka @ http://folding.stanford.edu/download.html

Swec:s F@H-teamtråd (eller iaf en av dem...) -> http://www.sweclockers.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5...

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HOW TO RUN THE WINDOWS FAH/GPU BETA CLIENT

This is a beta release and we expect that there will be several bugs, flaws, problems, etc -- releasing software for GPU's is itself very new in the software industry in general and we expect that there will be problems at the start. To minimize the problems, we have been testing the client and cores extensively in house and they run well there. However, it's our experience that running in the controlled setup in our lab and running "out in the wild" are very different situations. In Alpha testing involving non-Stanford clients, we have seen a lot of EUE's. We are working to track this down, but we need more data to learn about why this is happening, hence the need for an open beta.

As in the use of any beta software, please make sure to back up your hard drive, and do not run this client on any machine which cannot tolerate even the slightest instability or problems.

There are two steps:

1. Download the client file from http://folding.stanford.edu/download.html . For the console client, just run it as normal. For the GUI client, unzip the file to its own folder and then run the winFAH binary. Further instructions can be found on our console and GUI client pages. We do not recommend this beta client for those who have never run FAH before, as in this beta test, several parts of the client will not be working correctly and/or will require a knowledge of how FAH works.

2. Download and install the necessary system software. Due to the complex nature of performing scientific calculations on GPUs, the FAH GPU client needs very specific system software to work. We think that this is a big nuisance, and we are working on a way to avoid this in the future, but for now, there is no way around this (please keep in mind that a Graphics Driver is really a compiler or sorts and thus any GPU code is very sensitive to this issue). Please backup your computer's hard drive (always a good idea in these situations) and then install the following components:
Catalyst driver version 6.5 [download from ATI or a Stanford mirror] or version 6.10 [download from ATI], but not any other versions: 6.6 and 6.7 will work, but at a major performance hit; 6.8 and 6.9 will not work at all. Due to all the complexities of support, we will support only versions 6.5 and 6.10.
DirectX: 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904) or later, [download here] , which yields d3dx9_30.dll (the critical part for FAH)

This system software configuration is critical as a misconfiguration can lead to problems, such as excessive Early Unit Ends (EUE's). EUE's may also occur frequently in the current GPU cores due to our testing of new types of WU's. We need the help of beta testers to help pin down this issue with more data.

KNOWN BUGS, COMPATIBILITY ISSUES, AND RUNNING NOTES

Please note that the Windows GPU client for Folding@Home is a beta release. While we have done lots of testing in house, there are limits to the bugs we can find in these limited tests (and hence the need for a beta test). As in the use of any beta software, please make sure to back up your hard drive, and do not run this client on any machine which cannot tolerate even the slightest instability or problems.

Thus, we expect that there will be many problems with the client that need to be resolved. Below is a list of some of the relevant known issues or bugs for beta testers of this new client.

Known Bugs
The GUI pause core command doesn't work
The GUI Client will automatically quit when running fullscreen directx apps (games), it may be a little slow at doing this though
In some rare situations, one needs to set the Hardware acceleration to max if the Catalyst install didn't do this. To do this, go into the Display Properties/Settings/Advanced/TroubleShoot tab and double check that the Hardware acceleration was set to "Max".

Known compatibility issues
One must use specific Catalyst drivers (6.5 or 6.10) and a recent DX version-- see the HOW TO above
The GPU core does not run under WINE in linux (nor do we have plans to support WINE)

Notes for running
The GUI client will slow down the scientific core (since both use the GPU heavily). We do not recommend the GUI client for long term use, unless you have two graphics cards.
Multiple GPUs are currently not supported (but will be supported in future releases); Crossfire is also not supported -- Crossfire will make FAH run more slowly than using a single GPU (this isn't a bug as much as a fundamental issue regarding the nature of a Crossfire/SLI type architecture).
The GPU client is not meant to be run in the background while one uses the computer for applications with heavy GPU usage -- it will greatly slow down the response of programs which make heavy use of a GPU
Do not run multiple GPU clients simultaneously -- there will be a huge (non-linear) slow down in performance. We currently do not support multiple GPU configurations, although a second GPU can help speed up the graphics of the GUI.
Client looks like it is using lots of CPU time: Graphics drivers must poll the GPU to see if it is done. This will look like a lot of CPU time being used, but nothing is really being done, so one can run other relatively CPU heavy code at the same time. However, we do not recommend running multiple FAH clients, as this can significantly slow down the GPU client.

Trouble shooting EUE's
Some Alpha testers have found an excessive number of Early Unit End's (EUE's) -- we have not reproduced that at Stanford or ATI and we need help from beta testers to help track this down. If you see many EUE's (i.e. more than 20%), please make a post in the GPU section of the forum with your system configuration (ATI driver version, DX version, OS) and hardware (card, CPU, motherboard type). With the help of beta testers, we hope to nail down what's going on.
If you are seeing lots of EUE's, please download the ATItool application and check that your core voltage is set to 1.4V. This has been shown to lead to problems.

Policy Notes
The client will stop working after 2 months (this is a limited release beta -- new clients will be available before the current version ends its test period)
Deadlines will be set to be much shorter than normal, as we need to get data back quickly in this beta test and we are releasing to a very specific set of hardware. This will likely change in time, as we move from a beta test and as we move towards supporting other graphics cards.

FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS

GPU and OS support
Will X1800 cards will be supported in the new client as well? What about any other ATI models (i.e. X1600 cards/RV530)?
At first, we will launch with support for X1900 cards only. X1800 cards do not provide the performance needed. These cards are actually quite different -- they have different processors (R520, R530 vs. the R580 [in the X1900 series]). The R580 makes a huge difference in performance -- its 48 pixel shaders are key, as we use pixel shaders for our computations. However, we are working to get reasonable performance from the X1800 cards (1/2 to 1/3 of the X1900) and we will likely support them soon (hopefully 1 month after the initial beta test roll out).

What about video cards with other (non-ATI) chipsets?
The R580 (in the X1900XT, etc.) performs particularly well for molecular dynamics, due to its 48 pixel shaders. Currently, other cards (such as those from nVidia and other ATI cards) do not perform well enough for our calculations as they have fewer pixel shaders. Also, nVidia cards in general have some technical limitations beyond the number of pixel shaders which makes them perform poorly in our calculations.

Is the GPU client for Windows XP only, or has it been tested on other OS’s like Linux, Mac, and Vista?
We will launch with Windows XP support only due to driver and compiler support issues. In time, we hope to support Linux as well. Macintosh OSX support is much further out, as the compilers and drivers we need are not supported in OSX, and thus we cannot port our code until that has been resolved.

Are there any plans to enable the client to take advantage of dual-GPU systems like CrossFire, or even 3-slot systems that can support three GPUs?
We will not support this at launch, but we are aggressively working to support multi-GPU systems.

Running the new client
How long do you estimate this program will remain an open beta before it turns into a final client?
This is hard to predict, as it depends on how well the code works “in the wild.” Also, using GPU’s for calculation is itself new and so there may be unexpected consequences that nobody could foresee.

What scientific cores are supported by the FAH GPU client? Only Gromacs cores? Others cores like Amber?
We will support a special core for streaming processors only (Core_10); this core has elements of Gromacs (mainly for the "bookkeeping", but has a completely rewritten set of inner loop core -- the part which does all the work). Other core support (Amber or Tinker) is not planned, but is in principle possible, if the science requires it.

Does the FAH GPU client run the same WU’s as the regular FAH client?
No, the GPU will run a set of WU’s specially constructed for Core_10 ’s new functionality. While the Core_10 WU's use the same file format as Gromacs WU's, the scientific code which performs the calculation is different and the WU's for Core_10 will yield incorrect results if run with Gromacs (and vice versa).

How will points be awarded? What kind of impact do we expect this to have on work units and Folding team scores?
We will continue to award points in the same method as we’ve always used in Folding@Home. To award points for a WU, the WU is run on a benchmark machine. The points are currently awarded as 110 points/day as timed on the benchmark machine. We will continue with this method of calibrating points by adding an ATI X1900XT GPU to the new benchmark machine (otherwise, without a GPU, we could not benchmark GPU WU's on the benchmark machine!). Since Core_10 GPU WU's cannot be processed on the CPU alone, we must assign a new set of points for GPU WUs, and we are setting that to 440 points/day to reflect the added resources that GPU donors give to FAH.

How big will the download/upload files be? Can we expect modem users to have new problems with the size of a GPU WU? Will the Collection Servers accept uploads for these projects or will their size be a problem?
The WU’s will be small to start (<1MB download, a couple of MB upload). The download is small as implicit solvent calculations only need the protein atoms to start (no explicit water molecules); the upload will be bigger as we will need to bring back more data than in normal FAH WU’s. As we add more functionality to the GPU code, the WU's will likely get bigger. As the downloads and uploads won’t be larger than current FAH WU’s, we won’t have problems with the Collection Server.

Are these WU's compatible with other cores?
The GPU Gromacs core isn't a true port of Gromacs, but rather we've taken key elements from Gromacs we need and enhanced them based on the unique capabilities of GPU's. Thus, it's really a new and different core. GPU WU's can't correctly be run on non-GPU cores and vice versa. This enables some new and exciting science, but it's important to be clear that this isn't just a port. The new core will be called Core_10.

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Medlem

Jag tror om 1år utnytjar packningsprogram typ rar och filmedeteringsprogram denn teckniken för att snabba upp det hela. Mycket intressant.