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TekLager.se

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TekLager.se

https://teklager.se/en/

Hej SweClockers!

We have been operating for over a year now, and many of you already purchased Open Source routers from us. Now it's time to join the forum

We sell Open Source routers, firewalls and electronic parts in Sweden, Denmark, Norway and Finland. The company started as a small hobby project, but quickly grew due to word of mouth. Couple of forum posts from our customers on SweClockers brought a lot of traffic, thank you!

The idea to start TekLager was conceived when I decided to built my own router and realized the necessary parts cannot be found in Swedish electronic shops or are prohibitively expensive. Let's see if we can do something about that.

Feel free to ask any questions!

With Kind regards,
Pawel @ TekLager

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(Sorry for writing in English! My Swedish is still not fantastic...)

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Welcome!
You will be in my toughts when/if i´m upgrading my apu2 and/or force someone too buy something good instead of crap from d-link/asus/etc if they want my help.

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Nu när vi betalar för det!
Glöm inte bort att slänga alla plastpåsar i vattnet!

Skit nätagg (som inte alltid=med billigt) är enbart till för dom rika som har råd att byta ut allt när (inte OM utan NÄR) det dör!

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@grizzly666: Thanks a lot!

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(Sorry for writing in English! My Swedish is still not fantastic...)

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@teklager

Do you happen to have anything supporting Wireguard? I realize that the question is mostly software based rather than hardware, but perhaps if you could recommend a total solution? NOt sure if there are any stable ones for WireGuard yet though.

If we use OpenVPN instead, what could you offer that could give the best possible performance for underlaying speeds of 250Mbit/s and upwards? Would you recommend pfSense or something else?

Reason for asking is that I am tired of OpenVPN custom routers that can only give me up to 200 Mbit/s VPN speeds when my broadband is infact much more than that. Not sure if I am hoping for something that will never happen though

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@improwise: that's a good question. WireGuard came up in conversation with our clients few times, but I haven't tested it yet.

Let me run a few WireGuard benchmarks on our routers and get back to you. This will take a day or two, stay tuned!

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Skrivet av teklager:

@improwise: that's a good question. WireGuard came up in conversation with our clients few times, but I haven't tested it yet.

Let me run a few WireGuard benchmarks on our routers and get back to you. This will take a day or two, stay tuned!

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Thanks!

Just to mention, I tried out WireGuard using the TunSafe client on my PC, albeit a quite powerful one, and it blew OpenVPN out of the water with transfer speeds.

Any thoughts on the best to hope for regarding OpenVPN speeds on a TLSense i7 or something like that?

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@improwise: I expect WireGuard to outperform both IPSec and OpenVPN by a large margin. Let's see if my benchmarks confirm this.

On TLSense i7 you will get a full gigabit VPN throughput when using IPSec, and about ~600 Mbits/s when using OpenVPN. You might get a better results with OpenVPN if you spend some time tweaking the configuration.

On APU routers you will get about 100Mbit/s with OpenVPN. I'm interested if we can get 200+ when using WireGuard. I'm expecting it to actually be more than this.

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Interessting idea. pFsense as a firewall is a reknown and mature product. I will deffinitely keep you in mind when the time for the next upgrade comes.

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@improwise: I have some preliminary results for WireGuard running on APU.

I ran this test between two APU3B2 routers. The VPN throughput is over 600Mbit/s. This is over 6 times better than OpenVPN on the same hardware.

See the raw output from iperf3 below for details.

root@debian:~/wg# iperf3 -c 10.0.0.1
Connecting to host 10.0.0.1, port 5201
[ 4] local 10.0.0.2 port 36568 connected to 10.0.0.1 port 5201
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr Cwnd
[ 4] 0.00-1.00 sec 68.5 MBytes 574 Mbits/sec 66 1.41 MBytes
[ 4] 1.00-2.00 sec 79.5 MBytes 667 Mbits/sec 0 1.55 MBytes
[ 4] 2.00-3.00 sec 74.9 MBytes 628 Mbits/sec 36 1.17 MBytes
[ 4] 3.00-4.00 sec 74.1 MBytes 623 Mbits/sec 0 1.24 MBytes
[ 4] 4.00-5.00 sec 76.2 MBytes 640 Mbits/sec 0 1.28 MBytes
[ 4] 5.00-6.00 sec 81.2 MBytes 680 Mbits/sec 0 1.31 MBytes
[ 4] 6.00-7.00 sec 76.2 MBytes 640 Mbits/sec 20 1003 KBytes
[ 4] 7.00-8.00 sec 78.5 MBytes 658 Mbits/sec 0 1.04 MBytes
[ 4] 8.00-9.00 sec 77.5 MBytes 651 Mbits/sec 0 1.07 MBytes
[ 4] 9.00-10.00 sec 73.3 MBytes 614 Mbits/sec 0 1.10 MBytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Retr
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 760 MBytes 638 Mbits/sec 122 sender
[ 4] 0.00-10.00 sec 757 MBytes 635 Mbits/sec receiver
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

This is truly great. WireGuard uses all 4 CPU cores for encryption while OpenVPN is using only one.
If you are using OpenVPN you need much more expensive Intel i7 to achieve the same results.

I'll run more tests tomorrow and write a blog post about this. Thanks for the tip!

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@teklager: Curios, what kind of software are you running to test Wireguard? The main problem as I see it is that unless they have plugins for pfSense etc available, it would be hard to integrate with other stuff you would want on a router, like a firewall etc (well, at least in a small office/home environment).

Just so that people don't assume this is all ready to go with all the bells and whistles

"Warning: WireGuard is currently under development, and therefore any installation steps here should be considered as experimental. We are rapidly working toward mainline inclusion, at which point we will consider this codebase non-experimental."

BTW, are there any product updates that you expect soon in your product range regarding hardware? With the summer time comming up, there is need for some new projects and the urge to buy a new "PC" to try out different kind of pfSense installations etc

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@improwise: pfSense doesn't yet have a Wireguard plugin.

My test was performed between 2 debian routers. Debian isn't the most used router OS, but this test was a proof of concept.
There's a Wireguard plugin for OpenWRT. This might work well for office/home environment. I'll do some more testing during the weekend.

There's currently no plan to add new products to the store. Our current offering seem to meet the expectations of most clients. Is there something specific you are looking for?

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Skrivet av teklager:

@improwise: pfSense doesn't yet have a Wireguard plugin.

My test was performed between 2 debian routers. Debian isn't the most used router OS, but this test was a proof of concept.
There's a Wireguard plugin for OpenWRT. This might work well for office/home environment. I'll do some more testing during the weekend.

There's currently no plan to add new products to the store. Our current offering seem to meet the expectations of most clients. Is there something specific you are looking for?

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Great.

Not really looking for anything else, just trying to avoid the "purchase just before something new and much better is released" scenario

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On your site you write that:

"Hardware supportspfSense® 2.4"

but shouldn't devices like:

https://teklager.se/en/products/routers/tlsense-i7-4lan

Have support for pfSense 2.5 as well since the support AES-NI AFAIK?

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Skrivet av teklager:

This is truly great. WireGuard uses all 4 CPU cores for encryption while OpenVPN is using only one.
If you are using OpenVPN you need much more expensive Intel i7 to achieve the same results.

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Great indeed. For OpenVPN, a useful workaround is to run several tunnels and tie them together in a gateway group. Easily done in pfSense/OPNSense.

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Här hade jag tänkt skriva ett skämt om UDP,
men var osäker på om det skulle nå fram.

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Skrivet av Plattelöparn:

Great indeed. For OpenVPN, a useful workaround is to run several tunnels and tie them together in a gateway group. Easily done in pfSense/OPNSense.

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Are you then able to assign different CPU Cores to each connection as the the main problem with OpenVPN is that it is single threaded if I remember correctly? Otherwise I guess it would not mean to much difference IRL even with parallell connections?

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Skrivet av improwise:

Are you then able to assign different CPU Cores to each connection as the the main problem with OpenVPN is that it is single threaded if I remember correctly? Otherwise I guess it would not mean to much difference IRL even with parallell connections?

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In such a condition the operating system would balance the CPU load over multiple cores.

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Skrivet av pv2b:

In such a condition the operating system would balance the CPU load over multiple cores.

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Even though OpenVPN does not support more than one thread AFAIK?

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@teklager
Are there any plans to make 10 Gbit routers?

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Skrivet av improwise:

Are you then able to assign different CPU Cores to each connection as the the main problem with OpenVPN is that it is single threaded if I remember correctly? Otherwise I guess it would not mean to much difference IRL even with parallell connections?

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Every connection will have its own thread, so it's possible to really improve VPN speed this way. Been doing it for years.

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Här hade jag tänkt skriva ett skämt om UDP,
men var osäker på om det skulle nå fram.

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Skrivet av improwise:

On your site you write that:

"Hardware supportspfSense® 2.4"

but shouldn't devices like:

https://teklager.se/en/products/routers/tlsense-i7-4lan

Have support for pfSense 2.5 as well since the support AES-NI AFAIK?

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@improwise: All routers we sell will support pfSense 2.5. We don't sell hardware without AES-NI support. It's one of our requirements.

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I'm running https://TekLager.se/ - we build Open Source routers in Sweden :-)
(Sorry for writing in English! My Swedish is still not fantastic...)

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Skrivet av FakeNinja:

@teklager
Are there any plans to make 10 Gbit routers?

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I think there's some confusion about 10 Gbit routers/NICs. Consumer and pro-summer hardware is still at 1 Gbit, and will remain there for long time. Some ISPs may advertise 10Gbit internet over optical medium, but as far as I know you can't really get that in the end on your machine because network equipment mostly works with copper cables.

To get 10Gbit you would need:
- 10Gbit optical medium internet connection
- 10Gbit router (super powerful machine)
- 10Gbit optical medium switch (not cheap at all)
- 10Gbit NIC in your computer

The final bill will be in tens of thousands of SEK.

10Gbit may be the future, but this future is far, far away for a regular home use. As far as I'm concerned, unless you are an ISP yourself, 10Gbit is beyond reach at the moment.

Another thing to consider is that most of the work regular users do is on Laptops and smart phones over WiFi. WiFi is not even at 1Gbit still

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(Sorry for writing in English! My Swedish is still not fantastic...)

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Skrivet av improwise:

Even though OpenVPN does not support more than one thread AFAIK?

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OpenVPN only supports one thread, but in this case you're running multiple instances of OpenVPN.

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Skrivet av teklager:

@improwise: All routers we sell will support pfSense 2.5. We don't sell hardware without AES-NI support. It's one of our requirements.

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Yes, and this is why it is a bad idea only to list it as compatible with 2.4 giving the impression of something else

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Skrivet av improwise:

Yes, and this is why it is a bad idea only to list it as compatible with 2.4 giving the impression of something else

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That's a good point. I'll fix this later tonight!

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I'm running https://TekLager.se/ - we build Open Source routers in Sweden :-)
(Sorry for writing in English! My Swedish is still not fantastic...)

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@Teklager So, any SweClockers discounts on the TLSense i7?

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@improwise: sorry, we don't currently offer any discounts. Our margins at the moment don't really have any space for discounts (so you could say that all prices are discounted).

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(Sorry for writing in English! My Swedish is still not fantastic...)

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En liten recension av mitt köp från @Teklager följer. Kort version: Jag är mycket nöjd hittills. Det som är negativt nedan kan absolut inte skyllas på TekLager.

Beställde strax innan midnatt på måndagskvällen. På förmiddagen på torsdagen fanns paketet att hämta ut. Detta med personlig installation/konfiguration av burken. Imponerande.

  • APUC2C4 - Quad core x86-64, 3xGB LAN, 16GB SSD, 4 GB RAM

  • wle200nx Wifi, 2x2 SU-MIMO, kör på 2.4GHz

  • wle900vx Wifi, 3x3 SU-MIMO, kör på 5GHz

  • Rött chassi med plats för 6 antenner (5 utnyttjade)

  • Väggmonteringskit

  • Bygge, installation och konfiguration av OpenWRT

Summa: 3302.50 inkl MOMS

Plus och minus:
+ Med konfigurationen som TekLager gjorde var burken körbar rakt ur lådan

+ Till skillnad från mitt gamla Comhem Compal-modem så funkar 5 GHz Wifi nu i rum två betongväggar bort. 5 GHz är till och med bättre än 2.4 GHz (5 GHz har sämre täckningsindikation men bättre hastighet).

+ Lätt att skapa cron-jobb för automatiska uppdateringar, känns som en bättre hantering än vanliga konsumentroutrar

+ Gillar tanken på att det i framtiden går att uppgradera Wifi utan att slänga hela burken och köpa nytt, det räcker (förhoppningsvis) att byta ett MiniPCI-e-kort.

+ Gillar stödet för många operativsystem. Seriekabel var inkluderad för att kunna genomföra installation/byte av OS (skärmlöst).

- DD-WRT binder sina daemoner mot alla interface, inklusive WAN. Dessa brandväggas sedan bort så att de inte är åtkomliga från Internet. uhttpd, dropbear och dnsmasqs DNS-del gick att binda om bara mot LAN, men dnsmasq/odhcpds DHCP-del har jag inte lyckats med. Känns tryggare att inte exponera dem alls om man skulle råka göra bort sig med brandväggsreglerna.

- DD-WRT använder inte hela disken. Det går antagligen att fixa till när det behovet uppstår (89% ledig disk just nu).

Teklager rekommenderar separat router och AP och med två dagars erfarenheter så finns det fog för det tycker jag. OpenWRT känns inte som ett optimalt router-OS men som ett utmärkt AP-OS.

Jag har inte gjort några seriösa prestandatester så där tänker jag inte ha några åsikter än.

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Hej,

Tar du betalt mot faktura eller klarna?

/Patrik

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I sann konsumentupplysningsanda kommer här mitt utlåtande om TekLager.se

Utomordentlig service(!) Mailväxlade en del med Pawel och fick använda vederbörande som bollplank när jag försökta komma fram till vilken setup jag behövde. Jag var lite osäker på om jag behövde köpa en ny AP, men istället för att försöka sälja på mig mer grejer blev jag rådd att helt enkelt konvertera min befintliga router till AP innan jag köpte onödigt mycket. Så Snyggt.

Jag köpte en APU2C2 och är kanonnöjd. Såhär långt är det två saker jag inte fått att fungera ((1) ett NAT problem och (2) pfBlockerNG tsm med OpenVPN) men ingendera är TekLagers fel utan min egna inkompetens vad gäller pfSense.

TL;DR -- Jag har INGET negativt om företaget att säga såhär långt.

Ps: Om @teklager läser detta och har svar på frågorna ovan får ni gärna dra iväg ett PM eller mail

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Får det lov att vara en kaffe?

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@CrüeHead: We don't offer payments with Klarna because it's very expensive form of payment for us. Klarna charges 4.5% of the purchase price + high monthly subscription fee.

Purchase of 2000 SEK costs over 100 SEK in Klarna fees. I'm currently not willing to increase prices by this much, just to offer Klarna payments.
Klarna wants everyone to think that it's "free", but in practice products purchased with Klarna are significantly more expensive, just to cover the payment processing costs.

I know that we would increase sales if we offered Klarna, but we are running TekLager as a hobby business Sales are less important than affordability of the products and the fun we have building them

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(Sorry for writing in English! My Swedish is still not fantastic...)

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